[Assam] Covert Genocide Of Hindus In Bangladesh

SANDIP DUTTA pseude at yahoo.com
Wed May 23 03:29:58 PDT 2007


Good observations.
Rgds,
SD


----- Original Message ----
From: Manoj Das <dasmk2k at gmail.com>
To: Ram Sarangapani <assamrs at gmail.com>
Cc: assam at assamnet.org
Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 11:12:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Assam] Covert Genocide Of Hindus In Bangladesh


What is a Brahman or Bamun? Earlier times all 'buddhijiwis' were Brahmans; the ones with 'muscle' power were 'Kshtriyas' and so on and so forth. The divisions were not water tight.Time to time there were migration from one class to another. Vishwamitra, Vedavyas, Valmiki etc were adimitted to Brahmin class due to their intellect. Many muscleman, who captured power were admitted to 'Khastriya' class and theories were generated to make descendents of some God. The pet Gods in Assam side were 'Kuber' or 'Shivjee'. For example 'Koch' Rajas have descended form 'Sivji', Chutias from 'Kuber', Ahoms from 'Indra' or 'Lengdon' etc. etc. Linkages with Hindu Gods for 'Mongolian' kings were thus established so that 'buddhijiwis' can have their cut. 'Phuleswari Kunwari' and her two sisters were planted in the Ahom dynasty through 'trickery' and rest of history is well known to all. 
All the Muslims of Bangladesh were converted by a neo Muslim 'Kalapahar', General of the nawab of Gaur. Hindu Zamindars exploited them during last century and till before independence. It may be payback time, everywhere! 
As for me, coming from a farming family, my initiation ploughing was a disaster; the bulls were badly hurt, and resultant was a good scolding from my uncle. That was the last day on the 'kekura nangol' and I decided to become a 'buddhijiwi'- a neo brahmin. I think the days of transmigration among castes have began with more vigor. Mayawati has become 'Raja'; people from lower castes becoming IPS, IAS- neo 'kshatriyas'. A vibrant young generation is inter-marrying, breaking the shackles of casteism, it's a matter of time that definitions are poised for a 'recheck'. 
It's wrong to squarely blame the 'Bamuns' for perpetuating social discrimination. Personally I have great respect for them, being teachers and preservers of knowledge and wisdom. 
Societies are always dynamic. There are only two laws..'might is right'; and 'the brain will rule'.
MKD

 
On 5/22/07, SANDIP DUTTA <pseude at yahoo.com> wrote: 
Dear Sondon Da,
 
Thanks for the thoughtful words. However before posing the question on whether Hindus dont care about other hindus, my question to you is: DO YOU CARE? 
 
On this particular context of the alleged harrasment of Bangladeshi Hindus, I remember seeing you saying in some post some time back that they deserve what they get. 
 
I'm not sure if you are an expert on the subject of the Two Nation theory but I have reason to beleive that this is the cause of this harrasment thats being played out even sixty years later. 
 
Lastly - we cannot dismiss deep rooted caste prejudices as "impotence" of the constitution. While your American constitution also promises you deliverance in a free and fair society,  it still has a long way to go before it can get there. 
 
My heart goes out to the black victims of Hurricance Katrina.
 
Rgds,
Sandip

 
----- Original Message ----
From: " cmahanta at charter.net" <cmahanta at charter.net>
To: Ram Sarangapani < assamrs at gmail.com>
Cc: SANDIP DUTTA <pseude at yahoo.com>; assam at assamnet.org
Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 10:16:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Assam] Covert Genocide Of Hindus In Bangladesh


Ram:

>I believe most of the Hindu targets have been other Hindus - usually lower castes, and in the >South the Upper Castes by other Hindus..


*** We have been vaguely aware of the former problem, haven't we? Glad to see you made that abundantly clear. Would help those who go about wearing that cloak of Hindu victimhood. 

I was however unaware of the latter: Of the victimhood of the upper castes in the South. While it is deplorable and worthy of sympathy, somehow it is hard to imagine their plight, in light of widely 
visible  power of the upper-castes that rule not merely the south but all over India. 

And in all of the above, the impotence of the Indian constitution, its promises to secularism in public life and the inability of Indian democracy in upholding those promises.


>> IMHO - the strength of Hinduism doesn't lie on such grounds. Rather, it lies 
> in deep-rooted concerns for humanity in general, Words/phrases like Ahimsa,
> Brahmacharya (self-Control), Satyam,* *'Satyam e jayte' and of our immediate
> surroundings in particular.


*** I will not argue your assertion. I just wished they were validated by Sandip's charge and its implications and your own illustrations. The question in my mind continues to linger: In spite of all those lovely and highly evolved thoiughts, somehow, they never translated to the flock's commitments to their fellow men. In that the proof could not be found in the pudding, could it ? 

>> I do believe the Hindu identity is being dissolved to great extent. That is
> because of the religion's capacity to accommodate extreme belief systems
> under one umbrella.

*** This too leaves me bafgfled . I can't seem to connect the purported cause to the described effect :-). 

c-da









---- Ram Sarangapani <assamrs at gmail.com> wrote: 
> C'da 
> 
> You do bring up some good points - I had rather dealt with the subject a bit
> superficially, one might say.
> 
> But lets take what you say here:
> 
> 
> On 5/21/07, cmahanta at charter.net < cmahanta at charter.net> wrote:
> >
> > Ram:
> >
> > To keep things contextual, let us go back to the subject matter: Regarding
> > it being unfashionable to care about pilght of Hindus. 
> 
> 
> >If Hindus are persecuted because of their religious identity or prferences
> or >practices, but their plight is iognored EVEN by other Hindus, on account
> of it >not being fashionable 
> 
> While there have been instances (Afganisthan under the Taliban), Bangladesh
> & Pakistan where Hindus were actively persecuted and Fiji (where I believe
> the issue is "Indians" as opposed to "Hindus), I believe most of the Hindu 
> targets have been other Hindus - usually lower castes, and in the South the
> Upper Castes by other Hindus.. Even in Sri Lanka - the bone of contention is
> language as opposed to religion (it may play some role there too). 
> 
> >that would cast a deep shadow of doubt about the strength of the HInduness
> of >ALL concerned.
> 
> IMHO - the strength of Hinduism doesn't lie on such grounds. Rather, it lies 
> in deep-rooted concerns for humanity in general, Words/phrases like Ahimsa,
> Brahmacharya (self-Control), Satyam,* *'Satyam e jayte' and of our immediate
> surroundings in particular.
> On the contrary, many Hindus possess an unshakeable inner strength that has 
> both the ingredients of helping others (even across religious barriers), and
> at the same time keeping their often (viewed as) awkward practices alive.
> 
> >If they do, whart would that tell us about the intellectual foundations 
> that define >what it is being referred to as the Hindu identity? Is it an
> identity at all?
> 
> I do believe the Hindu identity is being dissolved to great extent. That is
> because of the religion's capacity to accommodate extreme belief systems 
> under one umbrella.  Further, entry into the religion is nearly always
> difficult - ie. one has to be born into the religion. There have been some
> who say no - but generally, it ain' so. Another reason why its identity is 
> depleting is because of conversions (forced and otherwise).
> I would venture that the Hindu philosophy and intellectual foundations are
> strong as ever
> 
> Well, thats my take - I am sure there are a number of Hindu intellectuals on 
> the net who can give it ago. But I just go by what I know, and the little
> reading on the subject.
> 
> --Ram
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> > Critiquing is one thing. But the subject under discussion is a whole lot
> > more serious. If Hindus are persecuted because of their religious identity
> > or prferences or practices, but their plight is iognored, EVEN by other 
> > Hindus, on account of it not being fashionable ( a superficial trait by all
> > considerations) as charged by Sandip; that would cast a deep shadow of doubt
> > about the strength of the HInduness of ALL concerned. Or at least it would 
> > seriously DAMAGE the humanity of those other Hindus who would not care about
> > their fellow Hindus' plight. Forget about others.
> >
> > If there is truth to the charge, how can you explain that Ram? Does it 
> > mean that the Hindu identity therefore is not necessarily a reliable bond?
> > That one Hindu does not necessarily care about the plight of another Hindu?
> > If so would they care about another fellow human? Or that would or could be 
> > different if it were somebody these Hindus might conside more worthy of
> > consideration, because it might win them notice ( fashionable) if they did?
> > For example one of these Hindus may not care about the plight of a fellow 
> > Hindu's religious persecution, but may be perfectly willing to raise their
> > voices against the plight of a Muslim or a Buddhist or a Christian or an
> > animist or even an atheist?
> >
> > If they do, whart would that tell us about the intellectual foundations
> > that define what it is being referred to as the Hindu identity? Is it an
> > identity at all?
> > 
> > If Sandip's charge has merit, it would bring the quality of the Hindu
> > faith into serious question, wouldn't it?
> >
> > c-da
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> > --- Ram Sarangapani <assamrs at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > C'da
> > > 
> > > While I don't know what exactly VP meant by "fashionable", this much is
> > true
> > > through: It is very easy to critique and often ignore Hinduism - Hindus
> > do 
> > > it themselves too. Few other religions can critique themselves so
> > freely.
> > >
> > > One reason could be that Hinduism represents a wide spectrum of people.
> > On 
> > > the one one end you may have a group whose belief systems are strict,
> > while
> > > on the other you may some North American guru khuwa bamuns.
> > >
> > > Further, Hinduism is a practice full of holes (if one wants to view it 
> > that
> > > way) and any passer by can take pot-shots with probably little or no
> > > reprisals. You can draw cartoons of any of the million Hindu Gods, write
> > > against them, and and very little will happen. 
> > >
> > > While other religions also have problems in their beliefs, one has to
> > tread
> > > lightly so as not step on toes - lest you lose your head :)
> > > 
> > > Lastly, the religion, is mostly very 'personal' - so it may come down to
> > '
> > > as long as you don't disturb or insult my "singular" practice, I really 
> > > don't care what you say'.
> > >
> > > And hence the "fashion" statement by VP
> > >
> > > Just my thoughts.
> > >
> > > 
> > >
> > >
> > > On 5/21/07, cmahanta at charter.net < cmahanta at charter.net> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >> No one gives a s**t because its not fashionable to side with Hindus
> > > > anywhere - be it >Bangladesh or Fiji. 
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > *** Very interesting. Did't realize it is fashion conciousness that
> > drive
> > > > people to care about others.
> > > > 
> > > > But if it is the truth, WHY is it FASHIONABLE to ignore Hindus?
> > > >
> > > > There must be some plausible reasons for it. What could those be?
> > > > 
> > > > cm
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ---- SANDIP DUTTA < pseude at yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > > No one gives a s**t because its not fashionable to side with Hindus
> > > > anywhere - be it Bangladesh or Fiji.
> > > > >
> > > > > Rgds, 
> > > > > SD
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ----- Original Message ----
> > > > > From: Pradip Kumar Datta < pradip200 at yahoo.com>
> > > > > To: silchar at yahoogroups.com; barakvalley at yahoogroups.com;
> > > > karimganj at yahoogroups.com; assam at assamnet.org;
> > assamonline at yahoogroups.com;
> > > > assam_dubai at yahoogroups.com
> > > > > Sent: Monday, May 21, 2007 2:18:42 PM 
> > > > > Subject: [Assam] Covert Genocide Of Hindus In Bangladesh
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Covert Genocide Of Hindus In Bangladesh
> > > > > Author: Narain Kataria 
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > A delegation comprising of Jiten Roy, Ph.D., President, and Bidyut
> > > > Sarkar, General Secretary, respectively, of International Federation 
> > of
> > > > Bangladeshi Hindus & Friends, Mohini Sarin, a Human Rights Activist,
> > Dr.
> > > > Narinder Kukar, former National President of the Association of
> > Indians in 
> > > > America and N. Kataria, Founder of Indian American Intellectuals
> > Forum,
> > > > called on Deputy Ambassador, Indian Mission, Mr. A. Gopinathan, at New
> > York
> > > > on January 20, and presented to him a memorandum documenting the
> > pitiable
> > > > plight of Hindus who are being subjected to relentless torture,
> > ghastly
> > > > murder, gang rape and forcible conversion to Islam. The memorandum 
> > urged the
> > > > Indian Mission at U.N. to take up this matter seriously with the
> > > > Government of India and find a permanent solution to the state
> > sponsored
> > > > campaign aimed at ethnic-cleansing of Hindus in Bangladesh.
> > > > > The memorandum, inter alia, stated that Bangladesh, where 11,000 of
> > its
> > > > 64, 000 madrassas are constantly producing jihadis, "has become a safe 
> > haven
> > > > for Islamic terrorists - - including Taliban and Al Qaeda fighters
> > fresh off
> > > > the boat from Afghanistan. " (The Time Asia Magazine Oct. 16, '02; Far 
> > > > Eastern Economic Review (April 4,2002); The Wall Street Journal April
> > 2'02);
> > > > Office of the Coordinator for Counterterrorism/ US Department of
> > State, May 
> > > > 21, 2002; Country Reports on Human Rights Practices for 2001:
> > Bangladesh,
> > > > March 2002) Time Asia Magazine, CNNews (Dec. 21, '01) New York Times
> > (Nov. 
> > > > 27, '01) etc. In the past one and half years, ever since the ruling
> > > > coalition of "Islamic hardliners" (The Guardian, Oct. 2, '01) assumed
> > power 
> > > > with an absolute majority, the Islamic extremists have gained enormous
> > > > strength demonstrating that they are capable of enacting several
> > Balies, if
> > > > not 9/11s. 
> > > > > Earlier, using the Babri Mosque incident as a ploy to teach Hindus a
> > > > befitting lesson, Jehadis had killed 15 Hindus, raped 2600 Hindu
> > women,
> > > > razed 3,600 temples and rendered 200,000 Hindus homeless. 
> > > > > Militant Islamists have looted, razed and in many cases set ablaze
> > > > dwelling houses, businesses, temples, imposed infidel protection tax,
> > > > gang/mass raped [ e.g. nearly 200 Hindu women were mass raped by the
> > > > Muslims in Char Fashion in a single night (The Daily Star, Nov 16,
> > 2001);
> > > > mother and eight-year-old daughter were gang-raped together subjecting 
> > the
> > > > helpless father/husband to watch such ghastly scene], brutally
> > tortured,
> > > > murdered, and left with the ultimatum:" Go to India, where you rightly 
> > > > belong." Incidents of rape remain generally underreported because of
> > the
> > > > stigma attached to it, yet among the 228 rape cases reported within
> > the day 
> > > > of election 225 or 98.68 % of the rape victims were Hindus and the
> > > > perpetrators belonged to the ruling parties (see, e.g., The Daily
> > > > Janakantha, Feb. 17, '02). When the victims of rape approach the 
> > police
> > > > station to press charges against the gang of rapists, the commanding
> > > > officers not only refuse to accept their cases but in some cases
> > > > >  also persecute the victim by detaining them in the precinct lockup 
> > > > (see, e.g., The Daily Janakantha, Feb. 17, '2).
> > > > > As a result of the above-mentioned systematic persecution, Hindu
> > > > population in Bangladesh has decreased from 35% in 1947 to 10% in 2003 
> > > > > Hence, the Hindus of Bangladesh have no other alternative but to
> > demand
> > > > a permanent solution of this problem, by creating a protected region.
> > If the 
> > > > Bosnian Muslims. East Timorese Christians, Srilankan Tamils, Iraqi
> > Kurds
> > > > deserve international attention, the Bangladeshi Hindus, 25 million of
> > whose 
> > > > people have been driven out of the country and 2.5 million acres of
> > whose
> > > > land confiscated, deserve help find a permanent solution to their
> > problem, 
> > > > too. Such a solution can never be achieved unless India intervenes,
> > like it
> > > > did in 1971
> > > > > Narain Kataria
> > > > > 41-67 Judge Street (5P) 
> > > > > Elmhurst, New York 11373
> > > > > (718) 478-5735
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Building a website is a piece of cake.
> > > > > Yahoo! Small Business gives you all the tools to get online.
> > > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > ____________________________________________________________________________________Be 
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